Talk:Hellfire/Mechanics
the format for mechanics pages is, in fact, unpredetermined and will be decided by the progress of this page and its successors. 19:34, June 30, 2010 (UTC) Wikia Overhaul: Hellfire The Wikia is in a sorry state. I know a lot of you have been trying your hardest, but, unfortunately, there is just too much incorrect information here. No pages accurately reflect how the game works. We, at the official Gearbox Forums, are going to be changing that. I am starting with the Hellfire page. First change: the cookie-cutter box on the right. The Hellfire is created by the addition of the acc5_Maliwan_Hellfire accoessory to the weapon. Its only modifications are +14(Pre-add) Tech Level, a +1.8 Cost Multiplier, and +3 Rarity. The accessory also requires the title "Hellfire", which has a priority of +5, a +1.0 Cost Multiplier, and a rarity modifier of +50. There aren't any other changes made by the accessory. The listing of "accuracy" on the box is irrelevant to the weapon, because that is determined by the other parts (e.g., body, barrel, material). Damage is worthless, because damage is scaled by level, in addition to modifiers from weapon parts. Fire rate, too, is modified by weapon parts. So on and so forth. The weapon displayed on the page will be the ideal (maxed) mag5, barrel5, sight5 version ("all5") version. Those stats (including some hidden ones) will be listed in the article, as well as the stats for the level 48 version, so that players without Knoxx can compare their weapons to the all5 version. In addition, we will be overhauling the "Special Weapon effects" section, listing modifications with data straight from the game's files. No speculation. There will also be a subsection listing restrictions. For example, Hellfires must be Maliwans, must have maliwan materials, and must have the TitleM_Maliwan1_Hellfire title. This page is going to be serving as a template for other Legendary and Unique weapons, so it'd be much appreciated if contributors didn't revert it back to an older format, because reverting to saves with incorrect/misleading info is such a way would be considered vandalism. If you want to help with the wikia overhaul, head over the the Gearbox Forums and spend some time learning how Gearbuilder assembles weapons. In addition, play around with the community developed GearCalc tool, which should be incredibly useful in learning how weapon parts affect one another. Best of luck to us all, L3VIATH4N 03:52, June 20, 2010 (UTC) Leviathan : This isn't exactly a textbook example of "how to win friends and influence people", Leviathan - more a case of "how to lose friends and aggravate people". If you think the Wikia is in such bad shape, all you have to do is what the rest of us do - correct errors when we find them and add new information as it comes to hand. No need to get on your high horse, or say things like "No pages accurately reflect how the game works". Just get on with your edits - if we like them, we'll keep them; if we don't, we'll can them. That's how a Wiki works. :And having read your rewrite of the Maliwan Hellfire page - I'm not overly impressed. The information you've added is interesting and useful, especially to modders and to people interested in the nuts and bolts of the game, but you've taken out stuff that was actually useful to people who just want to play Borderlands. :For example, removing the information about accuracy for the Hellfire is a step backwards; it's irrelevant to the majority of players whether the accuracy is a result of the accessory or the other components - the point is that we used to have a indication of the range of accuracies one could find in a Hellfire. Now we don't. How is this an improvement for a player who just wants to know whether their Hellfire is an accurate or inaccurate one? Similarly damage range, rate of fire and magazine sizes was all useful information even if it wasn't perfect. Most players are well aware that damage is affected by level and skills; the damage info was there so that people could compare the Hellfire with other SMGs and get an idea of it's strengths and weaknesses versus other SMGs. Useful, don't you think? :This is not your Wiki to order people around in. If you want to provide the perfect Borderlands Wiki, with all information meeting your stringent standards, I suggest you start your own. Outbackyak 19:28, June 26, 2010 (UTC) : :I totally agree with Outbackyak on that one. The remodeled Hellfire article may be more useful for techheads, but acutally it's way less useful for people just playing the game. I don't have part and material lists beside me when I play borderlands and I don't care about them. I just want to know whether a new found gun is better than a recent gun. And that question could be answered perfectly by the article you "ovberhauled" by complete destruction, Leviathan. The info box on the right gave a perfect overview on the weapon's stats' ranges was just perfect for me. I don't care about which stat is actually caused by what, I only care about the upper and lower bounds of the weapon's stats, which imo are well placed in a weapon's article. Your article, Leviathan, isn't helpful for me here. I'd have to read through 5 or 6 different articles right know to gain the info I want. :My suggestion would be: Leave the articles as they are as a combination on actual weapon info mixed with the boundaries defined by parts (I'd strongly recommend to revert the Hellfire article to an older state 'cause it sucks hard right now), and just add your tech talk as a new chapter to the articles. Ouverlauling doesn't mean you have to invade and conquer the wiki without discussing it with the community at first. Regards, Michael, 09:37, June 30, 2010 (GMT) ::please see Maliwan Hellfire/Mechanics. is this acceptable to all parties? 19:42, June 30, 2010 (UTC) :: ::Dr F. if you are responsible for fixing Leviathans "overhaul" then kudos. I see where he was going, but the truth is that most of what he added would be confusing for those new to the game. Your solution was great for those who wish to add all the material and generation information to weapon articles. I also think reverting the itemcard and description of it is better because it gives people an idea of what to expect from a random version of the weapon. Using just a "perfect" example and listing stats for that one weapon may confuse new players as well.GT: ConceitedJarrad XBOX360 18:10, July 31, 2010 (UTC) :It's a totally worthless addition to the wiki, but we have to accommodate the "100% Official Gearbox Forums" pudknockers who ride over here on their Shetland ponies and make stupid claims like, "No pages accurately reflect how the game works." That alone warrants a six month ban in my opinion. I mean, Leviathan's attempt to purge all inaccurate information has birthed a slew of opinion (inaccurate information, a.k.a., "crap") about the randomness of straight-up game play on the one hand and the futility of "all5" (huh?) weapons for those of us who mod on the other. Nice. — :